R: R: [hatari-devel] HATARI: no emulation of a Real SF354 Single Sided drive

[Simone Voltolini <s.voltolini@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

"Hi

the game *is loading* in single sided mode ; but it crashes later when trying to use the "read track" command, which can't work reliably because your STX conversion doesn't include the raw track data."

So is the HvC that don't convert it well?

Which other program I can use for convert SCP to STX?

"there can be 2 problems at the same time under Hatari ; maybe the single sided mode has some bugs, but your STX image looks very suspicious to me too.
So before any further research, we must be sure that your STX file works with the official pasti library under Steem."

Just tested: don't load


"See above, before telling it's an emulation issue, we must be 100% sure 
that your stx file would work with the official pasti dll under steem"

Just replied.

"pasti is not developped anymore, but it's still good enough to make STX 
dump from a real ST.

Under Windows, you can use Aufit by Dr.Coolzic which is known to do 
better conversion than Hxc (it "knows" more protections schemes)"

Ah that's great!!!


"try with aufit to see if it works better.
else post your metrocross stx image to atari-forum, I'm sure Ijor can 
have a look.
Post here : https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=28228";

Yes I will try, thanks.



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-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: Nicolas Pomarède <npomarede@xxxxxxxxxxxx> 
Inviato: lunedì 10 ottobre 2022 08:34
A: hatari-devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Oggetto: Re: R: [hatari-devel] HATARI: no emulation of a Real SF354 Single Sided drive

Le 09/10/2022 à 23:31, Simone Voltolini a écrit :
> "in your tests, nothing shows that the STX works on real machine."
> 
> But I simulate the problem of Hatari using the SF314 Floppy Drive Model that can't read the original image ad Hatari too.
> 
> "you made an SCP image and then recreated a floppy from the SCP image to test it on your real ST, so this prooves that the SCP image is correct."
> 
> Absolutely.
> 
> "but then you create an STX image from this SCP and test it under emulation with Hatari."
> 
> Exactly (do it with HvC).
> 
> "Now, either hatari has a bug, which is possible, or the converted STX is not complete and doesn't include all the date (protection) from the SCP image. Maybe HxC doesn't support creating an STX image from this specific game ?"
> 
> Maybe but the fact that the SF314 Floppy Drive have the same problem of Hatari on real HW let me suppose that there is not a STX conversion problem but that Hatari doesn't support that prection.
> 
> 
> "When I add some traces to Hatari for STX, it reports that the game uses the "read track" command for several tracks, but the STX file doesn't contain the "raw" track data, it only contains the sector and no gap/timing information. If the game relies on some results from the read track for its protection, then it's likely to fail."
> 
> Ok but why on SF314 drive the original game, and the clone too, can't be loaded? I think is an emulation problem must of all.

Hi

the game *is loading* in single sided mode ; but it crashes later when trying to use the "read track" command, which can't work reliably because your STX conversion doesn't include the raw track data.

> 
> I haven't tried to make the dump with PASTI on real HW: there is another program, apart HvC, that can convert SCP flux image to an STX file format?
> 
> "Can you try your STX file under Windows using Steem and the official STX library ? If your file works, then it's a bug in Hatari. If it doesn't work, then it's the conversion made by HxC that is at fault."
> 
> I can try but, I repeat, the problem exist on real HW too with the SF314 drive so I don't think is a STX conversion problem but I can convert the STX to a SCP one and then clone it again for test your idea.


there can be 2 problems at the same time under Hatari ; maybe the single sided mode has some bugs, but your STX image looks very suspicious to me too.
So before any further research, we must be sure that your STX file works with the official pasti library under Steem.

> 
> "My guess from the traces is that the conversion is not correct, but it has nothing to do with single/double sided drive,some data are just missing from the stx file (but I might be wrong if the same stx file correctly runs under Windows with steem)"
> 
> That's ok but you can compare the STX image that is present on ATARIMANIA of R-TYPE and Metro Cross and see the differences.
> 
> These are the only 2 titles that I've found (apart Giana Sisters) that can't works on emulation and SF314 drive so I suppose that the problem is not on the STX image.
> 
> "You can also post on atari-forum.com, there're several people used to dump / preserve ST floppies and Ijor (STX format author) is also there and could check your stx file to be sure."
> 
> That's right, but If is a Hatari emulation problem it will be useful to test it and solve it, right?
> 

See above, before telling it's an emulation issue, we must be 100% sure 
that your stx file would work with the official pasti dll under steem

> Which program did you use for make STX files, pasti? Pasti is not developed since 2005....so I really don't know, aparte a Flux Dump, how can be possible to dump an ST image and then let them work on a emulator.
> 

pasti is not developped anymore, but it's still good enough to make STX 
dump from a real ST.

Under Windows, you can use Aufit by Dr.Coolzic which is known to do 
better conversion than Hxc (it "knows" more protections schemes)

> Steeem SSE says that can't open the STX images converted with HvC, the Pasti ones works well.

ok, so if your metrocross stx doesn't work under Steem, then I think the 
conversion if buggy

> 
> The only one that can open STX image made by HvC Floppy Emulator is Hatari.

This should not happen, the official pasti dll should support all stx, 
this is the reference.

> So I can't make another test.

try with aufit to see if it works better.
else post your metrocross stx image to atari-forum, I'm sure Ijor can 
have a look.
Post here : https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?t=28228


Nicolas

> -----Messaggio originale-----
> Da: Nicolas Pomarède <npomarede@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Inviato: domenica 9 ottobre 2022 22:56
> A: hatari-devel@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Oggetto: Re: [hatari-devel] HATARI: no emulation of a Real SF354 Single Sided drive
> 
> Le 08/10/2022 à 23:09, Simone Voltolini a écrit :
>> If you produce it you can see it because the problem is not in the conversion but in the emulation.
>>
>> I’ve cloned and on my ST520 works perfectly but only on the SF 354 drive.
>>
> 
> Hi
> in your tests, nothing shows that the STX works on real machine.
> 
> you made an SCP image and then recreated a floppy from the SCP image to test it on your real ST, so this prooves that the SCP image is correct.
> 
> but then you create an STX image from this SCP and test it under emulation with Hatari.
> 
> Now, either hatari has a bug, which is possible, or the converted STX is not complete and doesn't include all the date (protection) from the SCP image. Maybe HxC doesn't support creating an STX image from this specific game ?
> 
> When I add some traces to Hatari for STX, it reports that the game uses the "read track" command for several tracks, but the STX file doesn't contain the "raw" track data, it only contains the sector and no gap/timing information. If the game relies on some results from the read track for its protection, then it's likely to fail.
> 
> On the opposite, the version at atarimania contains the raw track content for every track.
> 
> Can you try your STX file under Windows using Steem and the official STX library ? If your file works, then it's a bug in Hatari. If it doesn't work, then it's the conversion made by HxC that is at fault.
> 
> My guess from the traces is that the conversion is not correct, but it has nothing to do with single/double sided drive,some data are just missing from the stx file (but I might be wrong if the same stx file correctly runs under Windows with steem)
> 
> you can also post on atari-forum.com, there're several people used to dump / preserve ST floppies and Ijor (STX format author) is also there and could check your stx file to be sure.
> 
> Nicolas
> 
> 
> 
>> The protection check if there is a real Single Sided drive connected, seems.
>>
>> This version is different from the one dumped on AtariMania, is the first print in Double Jewel like Xevious.
>>
> 
> 
> 
>